THE PEOPLE'S FORUM
THE PEOPLE'S FORUM Lies about Vietnam Dear Sirs: As a boy, a certain satiric passage I read in school made a deep impression. The gist of it was that committing murder was a bad thing, for it...
...a most generous interview appeared not long ago about my writings and my personality...
...This is known to patriotic American Catholics as well as to other Americans...
...I hope that Steve Allen is aware of that fact now...
...He is asking for the opportunity for self-respect, for the franchise, for a school, a job...
...At present, both The Constitution and The Atlanta Journal are friendly toward me, and very kind...
...An awe-full choice...
...The gist of it was that committing murder was a bad thing, for it led the murderer by degrees to turn into a liar...
...The nonviolent rights leaders are concerned for the welfare of the entire society...
...There are still 416 cases to be tried...
...Fifteen leaders have served prison sentences of up to eight months...
...In his article, "We Shall Overcome What?," in your February number, Mayer presents an understanding of the truth of nonviolence...
...By June, 1964, when the Civil Rights Act became law, more than 1,200 arrests had been made...
...The vast majority assume that brutally enforcable law, is indispensable to societal order...
...Legal expenses, court costs, and fines have amounted to more than §10,000 for those already tried...
...Mayer...
...Mayer...
...This type of nonviolence is more inclusive than that described by Mr...
...It doesn't make any better sense than the writings of William F. Buckley...
...We still have a deficit of S3.000...
...Love of white man for black man is a matter of heart, indeed, but I do not think the Negro is asking for Mayer's love or mine when he faces billy-club and firehose...
...What earthly moral right, Steve Allen and William Buckley, has any man or country to destroy the other's works or life...
...If you are in any way interested, please write to us...
...If William F. Buckley were a friend of mine, or say J. Edgar Hoover or Richard Nixon, I certainly wouldn't brag about it in a progressive magazine...
...Joe Chern Madison, Wisconsin Allen and Buckley Dear Sirs: Why waste valuable space on Steve Allen's "Turkey Stroganoff and China's Bomb" in the February issue...
...National CORE has assumed obligations of $2,500...
...Allen placed himself in the mire of the Buckley camp, so leave him there...
...Thomas C. Hunt Philosophy Department Mt...
...It certainly is true that if we all (or only half, or a tenth...
...Mayer seems a bit disturbed by the conclusion he reaches, but the argument seems so right and so logical that he is forced to accept it...
...I hold no grudges...
...Allen infers that only the highly educated ever have a serious thought, and in this many of us, not so highly educated as Mr...
...lacking this, Mayer confronts us with a black or white fallacy, be selfish or lay down your life for the enemy...
...I define social nonviolence as "an emanation of a person's or group's concern for the welfare of an entire society, some of whose aspects are in conflict with the beliefs of the person or group...
...I think that this stems from the excessive individuality implied by the definition...
...An additional 102 have received suspended sentences...
...Martin Luther King, Jr., leads...
...but it was plain that he did not comprehend, and therefore could not believe, that he was dealing with an unprincipled man...
...Mayer may be quite right that "what the whites of Mississippi may need is to see . . . more Negro familiars without friends with guns . . . ," but he is in serious error to suggest that this is what the civil rights struggle is about...
...And what other organization can claim two Nobel Peace Prize winners—Jane Addams and Emily Greene Balch—as members...
...His sly explanation of the bomb-China matter seemed to settle things, then about two weeks later the National Review gave the addresses of many right-wing outfits and right in the middle of them appeared "Steve Allen, c/o Bomb the Chinese Bomb Committee...
...It was a shameful performance...
...Martin Luther King may be able to practice nonviolence in the Christian sense that Mayer discusses, but that is because he is bigger than we...
...His idea of truth has become so nimble and flexible, it can never set anyone free...
...The difference in the two concepts is slight, but the love of all men is something broader and more difficult to grasp than an individual's love for those individuals he is in conflict with...
...If we do not act now, who will...
...nevertheless, the phrase "I have written" would have suggested something to the contrary...
...And his case is obviously sophomoric, making it necessary for him to play with semantics...
...Palmer came out second best...
...He takes a set of a priori notions about social action, carries these ideas through to their logical conclusions, and makes some value judgments on the basis of his conclusions...
...He shows how the leaders of the civil rights movement, persons who could be personal exemplars of sacred heroism, have to choose between compromising their moral faith and sacrificing their positions of leadership...
...Stanley E. Weisberger Oneonta, New York Aid to Parochial Schools Dear Sirs: The naive sophistry of President Johnson's theory that aid to parochial schools is no violation of the Constitution because it "helps the child, not the church" gives fair warning of what will happen to our great American principle, separation of church and state, unless there is an immediate and unequivocal rally to its support...
...It is remarkably astute and lively...
...How tiny is the minority who invoke no retribution against sinners but plead forgiveness for those whom Jesus came to save...
...is a masterpiece...
...Our first president, Jane Addams, was called before A. Mitchell Palmer, and I can assure you that Mr...
...Robert Bott Haverford, Pennsylvania Dear Sirs: If Aldous Huxley was correct—when he said the art of every age is the clearer phrasing of man's increasing apprehension of Truth—then Milton Mayer has contributed to the art of our day and age...
...We hope that some group of individuals will take the responsibility for the coordination of such a project as an ambulance corps...
...Steve Allen Hollywood, California Clarence Darrow, Crusader Dear Sirs: Readers of The Progressive will be interested to know of—and are urged to endorse—the nomination of Clarence Seward Darrow to the Hall of Fame for Great Americans at New York University...
...Each of us should find out what others have done and learned in similar projects and with similar concerns...
...but may I make one correction...
...on the contrary...
...The WILPF is celebrating its Fiftieth Anniversary in April...
...Law" is an expression of this equal concern for self and others, summed up in the concept of justice...
...Freda Hliddel, Hall of Fame Curator, 1009 Fifth Avenue, New York, New York 10028...
...Furthermore, we owe these children a public education...
...Perhaps it is time for The Progressive to shatter the Milton Mayer myth...
...It seems to me, however, that in the very nature of our intervention and what we have done in and to South Vietnam over the past ten years, lies the greater shame...
...Nor is there validity in the argument that absorption of the parochial school children into the public schools would impose an undue tax burden...
...Ann Morrissett Davidon Haverford, Pennsylvania Dear Sirs: Last night I read with amazement Steve Allen's account of his recent conversation with William F. Buckley...
...it hurt, yes...
...This is the definition accepted by most religious pacifists, but it is not the definition employed by pacifists who are both religious and political, including many Quakers and civil rights leaders...
...And for sheer size, the yarn that we are militarily involved to help a popular government and a free people defend themselves against aggression from the north is easily the biggest deception in the whole bag...
...The assumption on which his entire argument seems to hang is a definition of nonviolence as "an emanation of one person's concern for the welfare of another with whom he is in conflict...
...The nonviolent movement has been a social movement, not a movement of isolated individual acts of conscience...
...But is it really necessary to cover the idol with excrement in order to destroy it...
...We too often end up trying to out-con the conservatives and out-"realist" the reactionaries, with the result that they are the ones who end up with the marvelous ploy of sounding like moralists...
...They wished to avoid the wrangling, bitterness, contention for funds, injection of religion into politics, and other divisive factors which prevail in countries with government-supported church schools...
...Hubert Phillips Emeritus Professor of Social Science Fresno State College Fresno, California Dear Sirs: Steve Allen—is he is or is he ain't Buckley's baby...
...Merrill D. Ormes Save the Dunes Council Gary, Indiana Lens Understands Dear Sirs: Sidney Lens' article, "Leadership for a World in Revolution," in the January issue of The Progressive, proves to me that he is one American who thoroughly understands what makes this old world tick...
...It is bad enough, or sad enough, that he has conned so many fairly intelligent men already—including to some extent, whether he recognizes it or not, Steve Allen, whom I nevertheless admire for his verve, range of interests, and usually courageous liberalism...
...Allen and others, know he is wrong...
...this should come as no news, and should not be deplored...
...Dee Smith San Diego, California Lillian Smith's Correction Dear Sirs: I am delighted with the interview Margaret Long did of me in the February issue...
...James T. Eustace Tacoma, Washington Dear Sirs: In Steve Allen's refutation, or re-interpretation, of William Buckley's interpretation of Allen's views on destroying China's bombs, where, in the whole conversation, was the notion of morality or common ethical considerations...
...I have not always agreed with him...
...however, the advances have been costly...
...If we start to support the parochial schools—and their own prelates state that the school-book concession is only a "first step"—we will no longer be relieved of the tax burden...
...involvement in Vietnam must be met with a conscientious alternative should bring together our convictions, energies, and experiences...
...Ross F. Kavaner Calgary, Alberta Canada...
...To understand Mr...
...Mayer, to withhold an objection...
...In constitutionally excluding government support of sectarian institutions, the founding fathers were not activated by antipathy toward religion, but by respect for all religions and for religious freedom...
...Although our champion, Senator Paul Douglas, has valiantly and vainly tried to block construction of a steel mill in the heart of the Indiana Dunes as you indicated, a compromise proposal has been developed which we hope will permit us to have an 11,300 acre Indiana Dunes National Lakeshore, even though this will also allow a port to be constructed in the area —provided the port meets certain economic conditions...
...Not because such leadership is personally gratifying, but because the> movement, without saintly leaders, could turn into a race war of unimaginable human degradation...
...they realize that violent acts would result in even greater evils, for both themselves and the whites...
...New York, New York Dear Sirs: In the many years of my subscription to The Progressive, I have turned first to Milton Mayer...
...and his absence from your pages has been a disappointment...
...There are many who are willing to help...
...Wendal Bull Burnsville, North Carolina Dear Sirs: Milton Mayer's "We Shall Overcome What...
...Wechsler, I deplore the chain of official lies about the course of the struggle in South Vietnam...
...Address your endorsement to Mrs...
...Endorsement of Darrow's nomination will count toward influencing the decision of the College of Electors when they meet to vote in April...
...Donna Allen is also the legislative chairman of the Women's International League for Peace and Freedom, which is just six years younger than The Progressive...
...The leadership of the movement in this Southern college community can point with pride to the success of its efforts...
...What I find wanting in his analysis is the possibility of an equal concern for self and others...
...You did run in a separate box the explanation that I was only a contributor to God and the H-Iiomb and Dialogues in Americanism...
...Contributions will be gratefully accepted by the Chapel Hill Freedom Committee...
...I recalled this mischievous little homily after reading James Wechsler's "Vietnam: A Study in Deception" in the February issue of The Progressive...
...Send your request to: WILPF, 2006 Walnut Street, Philadelphia 3, Pennsylvania...
...The Atlanta Constitution used the rather rough words about Killers of the Dream, not Strange Fruit...
...Lillian Smith Clayton, Georgia Mayer and Nonviolence Dear Sirs: Coming from another journal, or coming from another man, I might not comment on Mayer's "We Shall Overcome What...
...Kurt Link, M.D...
...Allen is entitled to choose his friends and even to praise them in print as he did in The Progressive...
...he is not even asking for our respect...
...If this highway to communal life is unacceptable to some Catholics and they prefer to build a private road, that is their privilege, provided they finance the road themselves...
...But now, in your February issue, our friend sets out to shatter the nonviolent myth of Dr...
...Even the title of his article, "We Shall Overcome What?," is a debater's trick...
...Mayer's reminder of the philosophic and moral underpinnings of nonviolence...
...were Christians, we would not need laws at all, and certainly not police...
...If those who are directly involved in relieving this suffering would pass their information along to us, we will, in turn, make sure that you will be notified of any specific projects...
...San Antonio College Walnut, California Dear Sirs: In reference to Milton Mayer's article on the future of nonviolence as a means of political and philosophical expression, Mr...
...If one opposes nuclear weapons per se, why destroy only China's...
...Our national office will be happy to supply more information...
...Taft was a gentleman (and a liberal within the context of their discussion...
...I grant that equality under law is less than love, but it is a giant step forward in human relations, and a proper objective for the movement Dr...
...This will certainly be hastened by careless, arrogant talk like Buckley's, and absolutely precipitated, of course, by any such wild action should Buckley ever really get the ear of some Strangelove at the Pentagon...
...However, I have too much respect and affection for The Progressive and especially for Mr...
...For instance, the civil rights leaders in Mississippi believe that the power structure of that state is evil...
...Election to the Hall of Fame would be a fitting tribute to this great crusader and a victory for human rights...
...Hank Oettinger Chicago, Illinois Correction from Allen Dear Sirs: I would like all your readers to know that the phrase "I have written," which was added to the second paragraph of my article, "Turkey Stroganoff and China's Bomb," was misleading ,and was an incidental addition by an editor...
...Why not destroy the people, who can presumably go on making other bombs...
...But who are we to say "Ho-ho, you nasty Negro, if you were a good Christian, and not hypocritically fighting for your rights under the guise of nonviolence, then we would stop kicking you...
...Like Mr...
...Even Mr...
...Each of us must take the responsibility for reaching those whom he knows would be interested in such a project if any action is going to result from our concern...
...I admire both papers for their civilized and often extremely courageous stand on contemporary social problems...
...It is an organization that gives one a chance to work, not only for peace but for freedom, and on an international basis also...
...By no means do all Catholics favor government support of their schools...
...Mayer's dilemma, we must broaden his definition so that it includes social nonviolence...
...There is a struggle...
...but he never let me down—not until his "November 22, 1963," when I felt he had stooped pretty low...
...He clearly discriminates between the champions of political effectiveness and the advocates of wholly moral means...
...Jess Perlman New York, New York Dear Sirs: Milton Mayer finds nonviolence to be "a very hard case," because it involves "ultimate concern for the welfare of the other," combined with total unconcern for oneself or one's victory over another...
...I can find only one word in my vocabulary to characterize Allen's article, and that word is "pitiful...
...To suggest that the white man's shortcomings are the black man's burden is a reverse chauvinism which Mayer would ordinarily spot from a mile away...
...This, of course, is the issue...
...However, they are on the horns of a dilemma when the power structure reacts by killing Negroes...
...The Senate passed this bill last year, but Representative Charles Halleck was able to block it in the House...
...As an example of what I mean, I refer to the nationally televised "Conversation," about a year ago, between Buckley and Charles P. Taft...
...A neutral "ambulance corps" has been suggested: a group which would help all those suffering in the Vietnamese war, a direct expression of those who cannot sit idly by while governments, most certainly including the United States, are acting inhumanely...
...Mayer is completely correct and consistent within the framework he has created...
...Why Allen did not know that he was dealing with a man who in intellectual controversy is unprincipled is beyond me...
...Joan Drake Chairman, Legal Fund Chapel Hill Freedom Committee Box 1094 Chapel Hill, North Carolina Vietnam Ambulance Corps Dear Sirs: All of us—individuals and organizations —who feel and believe strongly that the present U.S...
...To make payments as required by the courts, the Chapel Hill Freedom Committee has been forced to borrow much of the money...
...If we cannot get China—and the United States—each to destroy its own arsenals, they will no doubt oblige each other one day...
...That principle is not the only argument against Federal funds for church schools, but it is the most compelling...
...Mayer's children can give him the answer to that question...
...If there is "that of God in every man," it exists in me as well as in my enemy, and my concern is properly for both...
...The split which reaches to the very bottom of the civil rights movement, dividing the political strategists from the "religious pacifists," as Mayer calls them, also is discernible in the pacifist movement...
...Now that he is no longer Minority Leader, we expect better luck this year...
...in the February issue of The Progressive...
...This is not the first time that an official of WILPF has been harassed by government inquisitors...
...Chapel Hill, North Carolina, is one of the cities in which civil rights demonstrations were carried out on a major scale...
...The voting booth, a meal, a motel room are not matters of heart...
...in fact, we may find that the education of these children in parochial schools costs us more heavily than it would in public schools...
...Even the self-styled "Christians" are divided in the same way...
...And I heartily agree that the future verdict concerning our role there by historians and diplomats will be less harsh "if the conflict should terminate with the beginning of broad negotiations for an Asian detente...
...but it happened long ago...
...Other than this difference in scope, I agree with Mr...
...The editors, surely, have retained the right to exclude material, even when it is presented by as clever an author as the aging Mr...
...In such countries the best organized church inevitably works to the top and assumes dominance...
...Marie Hodgson Leonia, New Jersey Chapel Hill Appeal Dear Sirs: The civil rights revolution constitutes the most profound advance of human dignity in our generation...
...The masked violence of economic pressure or the civil rights act is more excusable in this context if, in terms of numbers of real lives lost, the welfare of the society is obtained...
...But to suggest that the Negro mass movement must take on this character to succeed is to ask Negroes to be better than whites, which means to subject the Negroes to continued oppression because they are not better than whites...
...Jean Sherry Darrow Octagon House Kinsman, Ohio WIL 50th Anniversary Dear Sirs: Your excellent editorial, "HUAC Shows Its Claws," in the February issue neglected to state that Mrs...
...And if by some quirk of view one regards only China's bombs as evil—that is, subject to the use of evil or ill-advised men—why stop at only the nuclear installations...
...Dennis and Wrenn Oliver 1287 Holloway Street Victoria, British Columbia Canada Hope for the Dunes Dear Sirs: We read with great interest your mention of the fight to save the Indiana Dunes in your "Word from Washington" in the February issue...
...Let us work for justice under law and within this framework go on to loving concern for the other—the case will then be less hard...
...He is an iconoclast, a myth-shatterer, an idol-destroyer...
...Martin Luther King, Jr., and his followers...
Vol. 29 • April 1965 • No. 4
