A Former Chief Justice Speaks Out
Carey, George W.
nantly Democratic. If Humphrey is nominated, they probably will not. But if Humphrey has Kennedy in tow, that is another matter. Without Kennedy, Humphrey would remind people of the famous...
...Fourth, Vice Presidents are protected by the Secret Service...
...It does not prove that capital punishment is innocuous as a deterrent...
...People who traffic in heroin for profit are cold, calculating men...
...That will leave an important question to be answered by Americans speaking through their state governments: Is capital punishment justifiable...
...There are only twentyfour hours hours in a day...
...Question: Justice Warrant, let me say, by way of introduction, that you have done so much for the country...
...fear of capital punishment could stop them short...
...conventional wisdom says that Kennedy would not take the second spot if asked...
...It involves fleecing the party faithful at fund raising events...
...As you know, it is a think tank wherein each of us has to stretch his mind to come up with solutions...
...Don't you want to get back into the swing of things...
...By all means...
...Little Susan who is only nine years old can now read the Declaration of Independence in its entirety...
...the week after, Los Angeles or San Francisco...
...Thank you so much, Justice Warrant...
...I really enjoy the program...
...I am working hard on this project and soon we will come up with Operation HI...
...This does not prove that capital punishment is the wrong punishment for murder...
...This is obviously true, but not obviously important...
...Years of thought must have gone into it...
...It stimulates the intellect...
...Now, Justice Warrant, don't you regret your retirement...
...In addition to all of this, as you probably know, I work on a part time basis for the Funda Republica Americanus, an organization not to be confused with the Republican Party...
...What would you do if you were still Chief Justice...
...He is professor of governmerit at Georgetown University and editor of The Political Science Reviewer...
...This is a constitutional right we are speaking of - - I shan't bother you with my exhaustive analysis of this highly complex issue...
...This might even necessitate a new cabinet post at the national level...
...I must add that I am beholden to the research staff of the Funda Republica Americanus for the research and calculations which they have performed...
...eighteen hours...
...In what areas do you find yourself in disagreement with the recent Court decisions...
...Because of the traffic situation in urban areas it is, in most cases, only possible to send a child to a limited geographical area in the United States...
...Clearly there is a kind of political blackmail available to a man rough enough to use it...
...Second, by accepting the nomination Kennedy could prove that he is a team player...
...Heroin is lethal...
...But it is not without certain technical complications...
...This means hat the children can only be bused for three hours one way because they must return to their homes...
...He was named the most popular instructor at Hayyard U. in a recent poll conducted by Elbridge Davis...
...And there are crimes as heinous as murder...
...This I should say is up to HEW and Congress because I cannot find, no matter how hard I have tried, a constitutional provision to the effect that parents ought to see their child or children...
...Could Kennedy refuse...
...From U.S...
...And fourth, we simply must control the weather...
...Your decisions, however, have been accepted by all those who seek a new constitutional order in the United States, an order which will fulfill the loftiest vision of our forebears...
...We have concentrated too much on buses...
...Question: This is an earth-shaking endeavor - - just brilliant...
...from Indiana University under Charles S. Hyneman...
...At the present time we are writing a new and modem constitution that will best serve the national interests...
...Answer: Oh, yes...
...But think of this: Operation H, when finally implemented, g o e s a long way toward providing for more integrated time and at a higher level...
...Question: Justice Warrant, I have never heard such a brilliant analysis...
...We just love our pier...
...We are, of course, nonpartisan...
...Views and World Sport (January 31, 1972...
...let's see...
...The buses could drop the kids off at the airport and in no time they could embark for school in communities, hundreds, if not thousands, of miles distant...
...In addition, we would expect our government to take the lives of foreign soldiers who, although only obeying the orders of their government, invaded our ~untry...
...Indeed, it helps distinguish punishment from (say) therapy...
...They are more interested in glamor than government and, anyway, they are convinced that you cannot capture the latter without the former...
...At age five or six (we are debating this quite heatedly, the question that is, of at what age they should be sent to boarding school) the child would be assigned to a school somewhere in the United States...
...No -- the I0 The Alternative June--September 1972 Constitution speaks clearly to this point: There must be complete integration of the public schools...
...They expect to be released by the conqueror...
...it also involves chatting with potentates and cutting ribbons at new dams in new countries...
...Louis, Minneapolis, and even Indianapolis have a very small Chinese population...
...Upon arrival the child will really be confronted with integration at even a broader level - - new surroundings, some tmderstanding of the region, familiarity with Chicanos and so forth...
...And then, too, another drawback is this: The Japanese and Chinese are in rare supply because they are so highly concentrated geographically that, to repeat myself, they would have to bear the major burden of achieving integration under Operation I and those with a large family will also suffer...
...But to repeat, there is more to punishment that deterrence...
...Opponents say capital punishment does not deter murder, which is the crime which most often earns the death sentence...
...Well, not very far...
...That is why Humphrey would offer the spot to Kennedy...
...We know, whether certain elements of the White, Black, Indian, ChineseAmerican or Japanese-American citizenry like it or not, that the Constitution simply demands integration of public schools...
...Question: I know that you are always thinking of ways to achieve the perfect society and I find R hard to believe, as complicated as it is, that you have spent all your time on Operation IL What are your thoughts and plans for the future with respect to the issue of education and integration...
...He does not seem much interested in senate business and his own party colleagues deposed him from the_ Whip job in favor of Senator Robert Byrd, whose personal attractiveness can be gauged by the fact that he is known as the Uriah Heep of the senate...
...First, if the ticket won he would escape from the senate...
...Six is right...
...If we want to consider the problem in the context of using buses for the achievement of the American dream, we are narrowing the horizons of our t.hiuking...
...My hunch, for whatever it is worth, is that Sesame Street is in large part responsible for this...
...This plan has real merits for it would also take the child away from the stifling influence of the family, particularly the parents...
...In what ways do you regret having retired from the Court...
...I told you it was a think tank...
...We now have these big jumbo jets...
...Anyway, schools would be set up in the United States to provide for the proper racial and ethnic balance...
...We are striving with some success to bridge the gap between nations...
...Capital Punishment The Uses of Nooses George F. Will T HE SUPREME COURT as now constituted may exercise proper restraint and decide that capital punishment is constitutional...
...eighteen from twenty-four leaves us with six--that's right, I have it here in my pocket, the figures from the Funda staff...
...An Exclusive Intervww A Former Chief Justice Speaks out on Busing George Carey a6 A FORMER CHIEF JUSTICE / ' X SpeaKs Out On Busing~ An Exclusive Intervmw...
...Our tentative plans call for all children of age four to be registered by federal authorities...
...My wife and I are leading a very active life...
...Kennedy's personal charm would make this easy...
...Yes, I favor operation II...
...After all, you were such an active force in rewriting the constitution during your term on the high bench...
...Surely you must have some recommendations for overcoming these difficulties so that the children of, say, Lincoln, Nebraska, can enjoy the American dream of full integration...
...I have to depend upon my little grandson Bobby who has just turned fourteen to help me...
...Treason is a crime of calculation...
...Question: All Americans are eternally grateful to you...
...How refreshing...
...Third, we need to build supersonic jets - - this is the best argument I have yet beard for the development of the SST - - so that the children will arrive at their destination in the shortest possible time...
...You, sir, stand as an example for so many...
...The child from New York can travel to Seattle, Washington...
...Answer: We have thought about all these problems at Funda...
...I can briefly outline the phases of this plan and indicate why ! think it superior to Operation I. Rather than thinking in terms of busing, we should rather think in terms of "planing...
...The Constitution is somewhat vague on this point and my researches have not provided me with a definitive answer, though I incline to age five...
...Fumla has just been granted some fifty million dollars by the Fraud Foundation to explore the possibilities of integration at the international level...
...Professor Constable shortly will assume new duties as Dean of the Hayyard Law School...
...Now, I have down here on my slip that the six should be divided by a two - - yes, yes, I now remember...
...Social conditions could drive men toward crime...
...Let me digress for a moment or two...
...to return to the matter of busing...
...George Carey earned his Ph.D...
...PerImps rehabilitation should be an intended effect of punishment for some crimes...
...Of course it depends upon the city and the urban area but given all the stops a bus must make as well as the traffic, we estimate that its average will be twenty miles an hour...
...and then there is congestion at the an-ports, problems with traffic controllers, scheduling, weather and so forth...
...The children would eat, sleep, and attend classes without the transportation problems...
...Also, in the SSTs, the noise level will be minimized so that the children will be able to talk to one another and hear their teachers...
...Your command and manipulation of the facts is astounding...
...The point is that if we use buses we can never integrate in the fashion which the Constitution and our Founding Fathers called for...
...Let's see now - - three times twenty...
...Now eight plus two, according to the staff at Funda - - I never paid much attention to figures - - come to ten...
...Answer: An excellent question...
...All this has not left Humphrey a soft man...
...Nothing could be more understandable than that Kennedy would want that...
...How those noble words ring in my ears...
...At no time did you spare any efforts in using your powers as Chief Justice to drag the American people, however reluctant they may have been, to a confrontation of problems facing all of us in these troubled times...
...He has coveted the White House for fifteen years...
...The first plan, called Operation I, calls for the establishment of boarding schools...
...BUt, Justice Warrant, the jumbo jet is really not all that speedy - - I believe it travels about six hundred miles an hour...
...Opponents say capital punishment does not rehabilitate...
...Besides, "social conditions" too often are the "social alibi" which betoken a sentimental refusal to blame men for their sins...
...I now see even more clearly why' they made you a dean at Hayyard Law...
...Lesser men might have retreated from the real world and closed themselves off from such invigorating experiences...
...All this talk does is boggle the mind and confuse us all...
...Since the oil dumping in the ocean and the underground nuclear tests, we have assiduously avoided complete immersion...
...However, with respect to the basic concept of boarding schools here can be no constitutional question...
...It is all form and no substance...
...Yon know, that three times twenty really baffled me...
...The dialogues we have had are so far advanced that the best I can do is outline two proposed plans, the first of which is less complicated than the second...
...I have lived by this creed, and I shall die by it...
...We have only six hours in which to bus the children...
...The limitations are too severe...
...There are four reasons why Kennedy might take it...
...We used to laugh when this happened...
...But he is not glamorous and it would take the close proximity of Kennedy to give him luster...
...This interview was conducted by Professor Constable, a leading student of constitutional law...
...Answer: Disarmament and all the questions surrounding our nuclear capabilities vis<z-v~ those of our presumed enemies...
...What of the German, Poles, Irish...
...I can see why your students think so highly of you...
...Let me say that when the Constitution mandates something it is incumbent upon us to fulfill that mandate...
...Have you thought of these problems...
...Now I see why you are a Hayyard dean...
...For integration to really work, the children should rub elbows (I say that figuratively, of course) for at least eight hours...
...Answer: You really put me on the spot...
...True, the murder rate does net soar when states abolish it...
...The issue is complicated because punishment can have three aims - - retribution for crime, rehabilitation of the criminal and deterrence of future crimes...
...Upon receiving his degree from Hayyard Law, he was appointed to the faculty where he has served with distinction for eighteen months...
...Never...
...But why should it be the overriding aim of all punishment for all crimes...
...Question: I can see very well, Justice Warrant, that you are leading the life of the genuine intellectual -- something you have always done...
...Does it not make sense to impose the death penalty on those who, although owning allegiance to our government, give aid and comfort to those who aim to destroy it...
...We see them about once a month...
...We now have on the boards plans whereby jets will criscross the nation so that any given student will not attend the same school twice, save, of course, for the school aboard the jumbo jet...
...Second, we will need a huge fleet of jumbo bellcopters with trained personnel to expedite the trip of the children to the airports...
...the next week, Detroit, Michigan...
...I provide the tunda staff with the broad and theoretically intricate goals, the Funda staff in turn supplies me with the technical infornmtion for the realization of my goals...
...Another argument is that capital punishment cannot deter most murders because most murders are unpremeditated crimes of passion...
...Despite some very bold decisions on the part of the lower courts, the judiciary has not shown any imagination in handling this very profound is~ue of constitutional law...
...If he did r e f u s e ' a n d the ticket lost, the Party would blame Kennedy for four extra years in the wilderness...
...This means it would take four hours or more to travel from Angeles to New York...
...Question: Wouldn't that be sixty miles...
...This, I believe, can be overcome through a federally funded program whereby parents of such minorities whose chip dren attend school in such distant places would be given free air transportation at least once a month...
...Too many of our socalled scholars get caught up in the business of de facto versus de jure segregation...
...It is too intricate for the layman to comprehend...
...We meet periodically to discuss various ways of improving America...
...Murder, like most social phenomenon, has complex roots, some of which attest the constitutional weakness of the human soul...
...I guess that is a family trait...
...If we don't do this we will be violating our most sacred principle, "'all men are created equal...
...Our future plans call for the following: First, we must eventually build new airports in every city of over 50,000...
...And by planing the The Alternative June--September 1972 II students to provide for real integration, we would overcome all the regional differences which seem to plague the country...
...Occasionally a big wave will come along and we get wet, all wet...
...Answer: The major issue where I have substantial doubts involves the whole issue of busing...
...He would be making what looks like a sacrifice: be would risk becoming Vice President, a job slightly less attractive than managing the Philadelphia Phiilies...
...Opponenm assert that if capital punishment neither deters nor re12 The Alternative June~ber 1972...
...And cousider this, too: One week the kids from Houston go to New York City...
...Other examples could be offered: There i~ a heavy concentration of Japanese people on the West Coast, of the Jewish in New York City and certain other meropolitan areas...
...Such schools have existed for years in the United States and Operation I calls for no drastic departure from our tgaditional way of doing things...
...Funda has helped me so much...
...This is, of course, a problem...
...But the truth is that we do not know if it deters...
...All of these and like facilities should be paid for by the national government so that big business cannot capitalize on our shortcomings in achieving our national dreams...
...Answer: Well, yes and no...
...And we could go on and on...
...Answer: Quite right...
...Of course, your decisions have created turmoil within our nation...
...Suppose, further, that the parents should be allowed two hours to bathe, clothe, and feed the child...
...All of this convinces me that the youth today are more intelligent and sophisticated than at any other period in our history -- or, indeed, in the history of the whole world...
...Question: You seem rather lukewarm toward Operation I. What is Operation II...
...Well...
...it was so much fun...
...Now you can see how complicated things are getting.., we have eight, two, and eight and that come to...
...Question...
...Humphrey is an enduring, engaging, familiar, friendly figure...
...Reprinted with permission...
...so let's see...
...Opponents of capital punishment say it cannot be an effective deterrent because social conditions - - slums, war, pollution and all that - - drive men toward crime...
...airports that will accommodate the jumbo jet...
...Peoria, Illinois - - you name it - - for instruction their school systems...
...Are you inclined to go along with Operation II...
...Make no mistake about it...
...It follows logically that the technical problems you pose be subordinated to the goal of the American dream and the Constitution...
...We were all planning to take a trip to Athens and ramble among the ruins of the Parthenon in order to gain some flavor of the spirit that animated those who can justly be called the real founders of democracy...
...It might well be that certain parents could not afford to see their children because of the expenses involved...
...Let us suppose that a child should be allowed eight hours of sleep a night...
...Yes, sir...
...But, unfortunately, since the fascist Greek colonels have taken control we have had to postpone our trip until there is a restoration of true democracy...
...He received his undergraduate degree from Hayyard, as well as his legal training...
...Every morning we stroll down to the pier together -you see it's only 100 yards from our patio -- and we dip our toes into the water...
...While aboard the plane, their teachers could instruct them and they could even have breakfast and lunch at their leisure...
...Thus the threat of punishment has no sting...
...Is Humphrey rough enough...
...I only wish I had the education I am working to provide for the youth of America and the World...
...The six-hour limitation under which we suffer in these busing schemes will not allow for full integration of the Chinese community in the mainstream of American life...
...When you have finished solving our educational problems, both national and international, what will be your next area of concern...
...Addiction is death on the installment plan...
...That is a crashing non sequitur...
...The most it proves is that it is ineffective as a deterrent for most murders...
...Might it not make sense to make treason and the manufacture, sale or importation of heroin a capital offense...
...What great men they must have been...
...There are so many different patterns and colors...
...But the most that demonstrates is that the threat of capital punishment is not the only deterrent to nmrder...
...Without Kennedy, Humphrey would remind people of the famous ,aging cow in Robert Louis Stevenson's poem: "blown by all the winds that pass, and wet with all the showers...
...Passion pre.~ludes calculation, and only a calculation of risks can deter...
...This has spoiled some of our fun...
...A lot of Democrats are hooked on a narcotic of their own devi~ing - - Camelotitis...
...Then, there are always the grandchildren...
...I never miss it...
...Also the coloring books for children today are far more intricate and fascinating...
...They are very active...
...The idea of retribution is the core of the concept of punishment...
...For one thing, let us imagine a very real possibility: To provide for complete integration in the schools of, say, Topeka, Kansas, we would have to assign a number of Jewish, Chinese and Japanese students to the Topeka center...
...We should pot capital punishment in their calculations...
...Answer: Yes, by all means...
...Third, the Vice Presidency would not be onerous...
...It would be unreasonable to expect nmrder to be eliminated by a single device, like capital punishment...
...Moreover traitors often expect the foreign government they are aiding to destroy the government they are betruying...
...Hooking a man is a slow, certain, vicious form of murder...
...Given the dispersion of racial groups in the United States within metropolitan areas, this is not much...
...Now given the traffic in our urban areas, how far can a bus travel in just three hours...
...I have done considerable research on this problem and I can say that the Constitution and medical authorities agree that a child should have at least eight hours of sleep...
...The Russian scholars who are visitors at the institute have given us some keen insights into our domestic and international difficulties...
...Tears come to my eyes whenever I contemplate their meaning...
...But there are various ways of "asking" things, and some ways are quite coercive...
...He was treated very roughly by several Kennedys ha some 1960 primaries, and especially in West Virginia, where they accused him of a cowardly war record...
...The problem is not so much that the whites have migrated to the distant suburbs and the Blacks are concentrated in the core or central city...
...Suppose Humphrey, without asking Kennedy in private, publicly invited Kennedy to join the ticket...
...Imagine this: A child in New York City can be in Houston,Texas in a relatively short time and while being transported will participate in the process of integration...
...Oh, if only we could have world peace...
...But think of this: San Francisco and New York have a considerable Chinese population...
Vol. 5 • June 1972 • No. 9
