A CONVERSATION AT LITTLE ROCK

A Conversation at LITTLE ROCK Seven students from Little Rock's Central High School were brought together for a panel discussion by Mrs. Jorunn Ricketts, a correspondent for Norwegian newspapers....

...I mean, that is why we fight...
...I know a student that's over there with us, Elizabeth, and that young lady, she walked two blocks, I guess—as you all know— and the mob was behind her...
...Minnijean: * * * I wouldn't want to go to Central to socialize and mix in...
...To marry someone...
...The discussion was recorded in Little Rock by N.B.C...
...Why do I want to go to school...
...Kay: I think that they've got schools to go to of their own...
...Sammy: I know now that it isn't as bad as I thought it was—after we got together and discussed it...
...A third Negro student, Melba Patil-lo, participated but did not appear in the transcript...
...But I know now that we're going to change our mind...
...I can stand out on the corner and socialize, as far as that...
...Sammy: Do you call those troops freedom...
...I mean, they're there just to keep order in case—I might use the irterm "hotheads"—get riled up...
...Ernest: * * * Well, I have to disagree...
...But I have heard they don't have the same opportunities inside, do they Ernest...
...And I also do not call free when you are being escorted into the school every morning...
...We fought in World War II together— the fellows that I know died in World War II, they died in the Korean War...
...It is because our government—our state government—went against the federal law...
...You're thinking about your boy—he's going to the Navy...
...But probably some of them would change their mind today...
...Ricketts: * * * Have you ever really made an effort to try to find out what they're like...
...Kay: [Sammy and I] We both came down here today with our mind set on it [that] we weren't going to change our mind that we were fully against integration...
...Joe: Well, Sammy, I don't know what freedom has been taken away from you because the truth there—I know as a senior myself—the troops haven't kept me from going to my ^classes or participating in any school ^activity...
...If * * * people got together it would be smoothed over...
...But I think if everybody would just obey the Golden Rule— dp unto others as you would have others do unto you—might be the solution...
...Excerpts from the transcript which follow represent a condensation prepared by the New York Times...
...Sammy: Well, marrying each other...
...It seems like they aret to me...
...I mean, why should my friends get out there and die for a cause called "democracy" when I can't exercise my rights—tell me that...
...Minnijean: Kay, Joe and Robin— do you know anything about me or is it just that your mother has told you about Negroes...
...You have the freedom of speech—I noticed that has been exercised a whole lot in Little Rock...
...Really, if I'm going there to socialize, I don't need to be going to school...
...Ricketts: What have you against Negroes in your school, Kay...
...Ricketts: * * * What would you do if * * * it was a fact that nine Negro students would go through this year at Central High...
...Joe: Because if he—if on September the third—if he hadn't called out the troops, I think there might have been some disagreements between people and maybe a few little fights, but I don't think that we'd have near as much trouble as we have now since he called out the National Guard...
...Kay: * * * I don't know what they would do but I know I don't approve of that...
...And may I say, I was very ashamed— I felt like crying—because she was so brave when she did that...
...Sammy: No, I don't because the South has always been against racial mixing and I think they will fight this thing to the end...
...Ricketts: What do your parents say to that...
...The freedom of petition, the freedom of religion and the other freedoms are guaranteed to you...
...Because I think we have been given a pretty bad side on this thing as far as freedoms...
...I mean, democracy is supposed to be our form of government and we are allowed freedoms...
...I mean—the Supreme Court made this decision and I feel since the Supreme Court is there to make decisions like that, you ought to abide by what they say and not have all this violence and stuff that we've been having...
...How would you like to have to * * * walk down the street with everybody yelling behind you like they yelled behind Elizabeth...
...Mrs: Ricketts: Do you think it is possible to start working this out on a more sensible basis than violent demonstration...
...Is there anything, finally, "we want to say that we have to say now...
...You are guaranteed your freedom in the Bill of Rights and your Constitution...
...Our country is set up so that we have forty-eight states and no one state has the ability to overrule our nation's government...
...It's not that I want to socialize—mix with other people—but it's just that I want to get an education just like everyone else...
...And we don't have any freedom any more...
...Kay: No, I don't...
...But * * * in my opinion I'd think there would be...
...I thought that was what our country was built around...
...Kay: I think that if * * * our friends had been getting in this discussion today, I think that maybe some of them—not all of them—in time, they would change their mind...
...It is really from an educational and economic standpoint...
...I'm thinking about mine—he's in the Air Force...
...Ernest: You say why did the troops come here...
...This was the cast of characters: White students: Three girls—Sammy Dean Parker, Kay Bacon, and Robin Woods...
...Unidentified Girl: I don't hate you...
...Sammy: Well I have heard talk around the school but I wouldn't say for sure that there would be any riots or anything of that sort...
...And we just weren't behaving ourselves—just jeering her...
...Sammy: These people are—we'll have to admit that...
...The conversation begins with a discussion of what would happen if federal troops were withdrawn from the school...
...We fight for our freedom—that's one thing...
...Minnijean: Hold your hand up...
...Ernest: Let me make that clear...
...Sammy: Not until today...
...Sammy: Well, * * * I think you all have a choice of which school to go to—and I think they ought to give us a choice too...
...Robin: Well, Horace Mann [Negro school] is a beautiful school, I'll admit that...
...So why can't I go to the school that's in my neighborhood— why should I have to go two or three miles every day—when there's a school in my district...
...What do you mean...
...I think it is mostly—the violence that we had on Monday morning—it was mostly the parents and not the children in school...
...Ricketts: Race mixing...
...I think that people ought to be limited by their ability only— not by the color of their skin...
...Kay: Well, you know that my parents and a lot of the other students and their parents think that the Negroes aren't equal to us...
...I don't mind them going to school with me...
...Sammy: Well, I think it is mostly race mixing...
...Sammy: I think you are wrong...
...News and broadcast recently...
...Ricketts: Sammy, why do these children not want to go to school with Negroes...
...Joe: May I make a suggestion to the Student Council * * *? We can go up there and talk [about it...
...Did the troops break up the mob...
...We think about the same thing...
...Minnijean: Dislike...
...Kay: I think I'm going to have a long talk with my parents...
...I don't know [where] people get all that...
...And I think that our Governor was trying to protect all of us when he called out the National Guard-—and he was trying to prepare us, I think...
...I mean, we have just stated a part—the fact, I think you have a lot better—a lot nicer school than we have—much more modern...
...as far as I'm concerned, I'll lay the whole blame of this trouble in Governor Faubus' lap...
...We are all of the same thoughts...
...I mean, school's not a marriage bureau * * * I'm going there for an education...
...That's what most of us have against them...
...one boy—Joseph Fox...
...What have you been taught that makes * * * you just hate us so much...
...They ought to have a panel discussion or something like that to let all of the kids know—not just a few but all of the kids...
...Kay: Not until today...
...Robin: I agree with Ernest...
...Ricketts: And what do you think about it after today...
...Ernest: Well, getting back to this intermarriage and all that...
...Robin: * * * They are there for education—they're not going to inter-marry—they're not going to have dates...
...I told you I did not approve violence...
...I think that's what they ought to do in Central...
...Robin: * * * I wouldn't be opposed to it...
...one boy—Ernest Green...
...But '$ think as long as—if parents would [Just stay out of it and let the children of the school at Central High figure it out for themselves, I think it would be a whole lot better...
...What's the difference...
...Ernest: Well, the reason I went over to Central was * * * that I, * • * being a citizen of the United States, , have just as much right as the other person...
...I'm brown, you are white...
...I don't...
...Sammy: I think we knew before this ever started that some day we were going to have to integrate the schools...
...Ernest: Sammy, you said that you don't have freedom...
...Ricketts: Let's see...
...As far as freedom, I think that if anybody should kick about freedoms, it should be us...
...Negro students: One girl—Minni-jean Brown...
...I think if we had had any sort of decency, we wouldn't have acted that way...
...Horace Mann is a modern building...
...Joe: I feel the same way that Robin does...
...Sammy: I'll have to agree with you...
...Ricketts: But do you approve of having the Negroes still going to school if the troops were pulled out...
...Kay: Do you suppose we can get that word out...
...Unidentified Girl: I don't dislike you either...
...But—I don't know...
...But then Horace Mann just doesn't have the courses that Central has...
...I think the students are mature enough to figure it out for themselves...
...Robin: * * * And when Elizabeth had to walk down in front of the school I was there and I saw that...
...Ernest: I think, like we're doing today, discussing our different views * * * if the people of Little Rock * * * would get together I believe they would" find out a different story—and try to discuss the thing instead of getting out in the street and kicking people around and calling names—and all that sort of thing...

Vol. 21 • December 1957 • No. 12


 
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